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 Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010

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satanspawngenma
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 3:46 am

so just real quick to make sure i got all of this, making sure there is no mis communications here(like what seems to have been going on). i am in the first contest, and im supposed to make a earth element Ninja card by sunday, correct?
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naruto4ever
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 3:50 am

satanspawngenma wrote:
so just real quick to make sure i got all of this, making sure there is no mis communications here(like what seems to have been going on). i am in the first contest, and im supposed to make a earth element Ninja card by sunday, correct?

This is correct and I wish you the best of luck.
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chidoricurrent2
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 4:31 am

naruto4ever wrote:
Round 1 and what better than an Earth Ninja! MJM, can you get on skype to explain to me the NCAA style you are going at? Thanks!


you're one little lucky mo fo n4e!
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 5:04 am

So I don't make a card this week or what? I'm slightly confused lol
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satanspawngenma
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 6:26 am

thank you N4E, i wish you the best of luck as well:)
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aurelio
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 7:19 am

Zero wrote:
...
i know you don't care who wins, just like i don't care.
i know your score book is "different".
i know my effect was maybe hard to understand at the first time. but that's fine, i understand you.

my apologies to everyone i mentioned in my previous post. i really don't have anything against you or your entries.
i am giving up.

[edit] what a shame, lovely ino gave up. it could be cool to watch clash between shino's dad and ino, which are the best and most creative card makers IMO.
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:46 pm

aurelio wrote:
Zero wrote:
...
i know you don't care who wins, just like i don't care.
i know your score book is "different".
i know my effect was maybe hard to understand at the first time. but that's fine, i understand you.

my apologies to everyone i mentioned in my previous post. i really don't have anything against you or your entries.
i am giving up.

[edit] what a shame, lovely ino gave up. it could be cool to watch clash between shino's dad and ino, which are the best and most creative card makers IMO.

In the end VSA gave up because he didn't want to start trouble. So please join back in.

Also, this may seem fair but VSA is going to be our "extra". If someone is absent from a round, instead of having a bye, you will go against VSA instead. Is that fair with everyone?

Thanks to NP for posting the brackets as a banner.
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satanspawngenma
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:50 pm

thats perfectly fine with me Thumbs up
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Susano'o the Storm God
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:53 pm

MJM wrote:
aurelio wrote:
Zero wrote:
...
i know you don't care who wins, just like i don't care.
i know your score book is "different".
i know my effect was maybe hard to understand at the first time. but that's fine, i understand you.

my apologies to everyone i mentioned in my previous post. i really don't have anything against you or your entries.
i am giving up.

[edit] what a shame, lovely ino gave up. it could be cool to watch clash between shino's dad and ino, which are the best and most creative card makers IMO.

In the end VSA gave up because he didn't want to start trouble. So please join back in.

Also, this may seem fair but VSA is going to be our "extra". If someone is absent from a round, instead of having a bye, you will go against VSA instead. Is that fair with everyone?

Thanks to NP for posting the brackets as a banner.

that's fine with me.
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Undeadflayme
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:59 pm

oh **** im matched up with a good card maker im gunna lose
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Susano'o the Storm God
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 11:06 pm

Undeadflayme wrote:
oh **** im matched up with a good card maker im gunna lose

I think lightning loves you. First, I have you make lightning cards for our set, then you make a lightning card for your entry, and now you have to make a lightning card for the round of 16 lol. But don't say that, even if you suck ***, you won't get anywhere without actually attempting to win.
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Susano'o the Storm God
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 11:16 pm

MJM wrote:
Alright, let's keep this moving, shall we? I apologize for the lateness of Round One information. One of our judges, Thayli, quickly came up with a much better bracket and thus I had to Photoshop it. As I was Photoshoping it, my CS3 froze and the file I was working on was not saved. I somehow was able to "Print Screen" what was left and just filled in the gaps afterwards which took up a long time. Nonetheless, here is the bracket.

Spoiler:
 

(Edit: Turns out the full image doesn't show. To see the rest, go here.)

We will be doing a "NCAA Basketball Tournament Style" bracket. So the 4 contestants in each corner will go against whoever their respective "kunai" is pointing to. Then, the winner of that will face the winner of the other match in their corner. Then we will continue to Top 8, Top 4, etc.

Now we will be doing 2 matches, a.k.a. 1 corner, per round at the moment. This is to speed things up a bit and hopefully we will be able to finish Top 16 within a months time.

How were you matched up? Thayli did this randomly.

Now, what do the Ninja and Element Symbols mean? They give you the Requirements of your round. For example, Round 1 involves 2 pairs. The 1st pair must make an Earth Ninja while the 2nd pair must make a Fire Ninja. How were the requirements decided?

Well I used an Elemental NJM system. It goes in this order.

Earth Ninja
Fire Ninja
Lightning Ninja
Water Ninja
Wind Ninja
Earth Jutsu
Fire Jutsu
Lightning Jutsu
Water Jutsu
Wind Jutsu
Earth Mission
Fire Mission
Lightning Mission
Water Mission
Wind Mission

We will be following this format until Top 4 where there are less restrictive requirements. I believe this is fair.

Now Round 1 will end 12:00 AM EST on Sunday, November 22nd, 2010. Judges should post their judgings by 12:00 AM EST, on Saturday, November 28th, 2010. During that week, Round 2 will take place. Further details will be announced in the future.

Trivia: The background of the bracket is in honor of VSA who dropped out upon request. This was his mat design from a while back. Fitting, no?

also MJM, would you have to wait until the top 4 matches before you can use Void Cards? Just curious
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aurelio
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 11:26 pm

i won't take back my words. that's my way of the ninja.
enjoy the rest of the tournament. good luck and have fun.
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Susano'o the Storm God
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Tue Nov 16, 2010 11:45 pm

aurelio wrote:
i won't take back my words. that's my way of the ninja.
enjoy the rest of the tournament. good luck and have fun.

why?
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MJM
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:55 am

Susano'o the Storm God wrote:
also MJM, would you have to wait until the top 4 matches before you can use Void Cards? Just curious

Void will not be used because it is too new and a couple people don't have it yet.

Aurelio: You don't really have to drop out. I understand judging was bad for you but this is a tournament. Cards aren't being judged by a card maker's perspective, rather an actual player's perspective. Isn't that what card making should be about?

If you really are quitting, I talked to VSA. He said he can fill in.

I'll update brackets when it's time.
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mendokuse
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:07 am

Wow drama.
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Shino'sDad
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:50 am

mendokuse wrote:
Wow drama.

lol drama.
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:12 am

Ninja Pebble: 19 + 14.75 + 15 = 48.75/75

User Name: 16 + 15.5 + 17.5 = 49/75

This is a pretty even match up... I already made my card :P
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satanspawngenma
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:13 am

yup drama is pretty much everywhere


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naruto4ever
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:16 am

So finished the art for my card (I am very pleased btw!) I just need to work out a few kinks and then my card will be posted.
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venkelos
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Wed Nov 17, 2010 11:44 am

I think I'm glad that I reserve all of my card-making emotions for wrath and hatred, wrath and hatred for MS PhotoDraw, when it decides to act up on me.

As a side note, I am wondering, based on the above banner, Mendo and I have to each make a competing Wind Ninja, 3 weeks from now? Just needing to be sure. Thanks.
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Thu Nov 18, 2010 2:45 pm

aurelio wrote:
first of all, i hate people who don't respect intelligence of other people. for instance i am talking about this retarded question:
Quote :
I dont believe you are in the bottom 2, so why exactly are you giving up?

i am giving up because judging was made with prejudices, and wasn't fair. like lovely ino said, there are entries with visible errors which are scored better than "0" or "1".

i respect guys like mjm, vsa, thayli, and others who are posting much on bandai and who are in naruto ccg for a long time, and i respect their experience in naruto ccg. i also respect mendokuse and naruto4ever like really good card makers. but, since this is a tournament of naruto fans, and judges are from bandai forum, i really can't take the fact that judging is based on giving a credits in a form of high scores for a card making, to guys who are posting every day on bandai forum, or to a guys who are in administration on this forum, which absolutely doesn't have anything with this tournament. i really don't point out to anyone.

thayli's judging was pretty good but judging of tsukiyome and zero wasn't fair at all. i really can't stand that somebody will hit "0" or "1" just because he is able to do that. this is supposed to be a fun, not a playground for a guys who are responsible for something irrelevant once in a lifetime. are you feeling powerful when you hit "0" or "1"?

If you want the justification for the effect being a "0", I didn't do it for no reason. First off, the effect was difficult to understand based on the wording. From my understanding, it became very apparent to me that it was not a fair card. Not only does it completely break the mechanics of the game, how do I keep track of who has been organized with who? Say I have Naruto and I team him with Shikamaru. Then Naruto dies. Can I group Shikamaru again? From my understanding, the card says I can't group him with other Ninjas again so I assume that means he's by himself for the rest of the game. If that's the case, after 12 turns pass, how can you prove the Shikamaru was already teamed before?

I realize the card is a super rare and thus deserves to be powerful, but I'm a big proponent of balance. And given the scoring template I was told to use, effect basically dealt with Balance from my understanding (See "Pa Toad" which also got a 0 in the effect for me because it completely shatters the game's balance and would ruin the actual game if it was released.). Creativity dealt with uniqueness. Text & Neatness also overlapped. The general consensus between the judges was that this round was a nightmare in terms of scoring and a new scoring system needs to be ironed out before we can even proceed any further so the drama from a round like this doesn't happen again.

Lovely Ino wrote:
Okie dokie, I guess I'd like to withdraw from the tourney.

I dislike this situation. Really, I'm on Susano'o's side here that the late entry was a touch unprofessional, and I can understand him feeling cheated. So, this works out best since VSA and Susano'o can both proceed. Good luck, guys.

It's sad to see you go as I felt you had one of the most creativie cards in the tournament's first round. I was looking forward to more of your work. I also want to personally thank you for pointing out the capitalization errors. I've judged cards before but never on this level and the text scores were the first thing I apologized for (See our blog "The Perfect Curve"). Honestly, capitalization never even occured to me. After talking with Zero and Thayli, we all kind of agree there is definitely overlap in the current scoring system and a better rubric needs to be made before the next round. Capitalization will be a big thing.

As for Susano'o, as was said before, I'm sorry you were upset about things but please, as Mendo said, bring your A game. A competition is a competition to win (while still having fun! ^_^).
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Susano'o the Storm God
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Thu Nov 18, 2010 5:44 pm

Tsu Kiyo Me wrote:
aurelio wrote:
first of all, i hate people who don't respect intelligence of other people. for instance i am talking about this retarded question:
Quote :
I dont believe you are in the bottom 2, so why exactly are you giving up?

i am giving up because judging was made with prejudices, and wasn't fair. like lovely ino said, there are entries with visible errors which are scored better than "0" or "1".

i respect guys like mjm, vsa, thayli, and others who are posting much on bandai and who are in naruto ccg for a long time, and i respect their experience in naruto ccg. i also respect mendokuse and naruto4ever like really good card makers. but, since this is a tournament of naruto fans, and judges are from bandai forum, i really can't take the fact that judging is based on giving a credits in a form of high scores for a card making, to guys who are posting every day on bandai forum, or to a guys who are in administration on this forum, which absolutely doesn't have anything with this tournament. i really don't point out to anyone.

thayli's judging was pretty good but judging of tsukiyome and zero wasn't fair at all. i really can't stand that somebody will hit "0" or "1" just because he is able to do that. this is supposed to be a fun, not a playground for a guys who are responsible for something irrelevant once in a lifetime. are you feeling powerful when you hit "0" or "1"?

If you want the justification for the effect being a "0", I didn't do it for no reason. First off, the effect was difficult to understand based on the wording. From my understanding, it became very apparent to me that it was not a fair card. Not only does it completely break the mechanics of the game, how do I keep track of who has been organized with who? Say I have Naruto and I team him with Shikamaru. Then Naruto dies. Can I group Shikamaru again? From my understanding, the card says I can't group him with other Ninjas again so I assume that means he's by himself for the rest of the game. If that's the case, after 12 turns pass, how can you prove the Shikamaru was already teamed before?

I realize the card is a super rare and thus deserves to be powerful, but I'm a big proponent of balance. And given the scoring template I was told to use, effect basically dealt with Balance from my understanding (See "Pa Toad" which also got a 0 in the effect for me because it completely shatters the game's balance and would ruin the actual game if it was released.). Creativity dealt with uniqueness. Text & Neatness also overlapped. The general consensus between the judges was that this round was a nightmare in terms of scoring and a new scoring system needs to be ironed out before we can even proceed any further so the drama from a round like this doesn't happen again.

Lovely Ino wrote:
Okie dokie, I guess I'd like to withdraw from the tourney.

I dislike this situation. Really, I'm on Susano'o's side here that the late entry was a touch unprofessional, and I can understand him feeling cheated. So, this works out best since VSA and Susano'o can both proceed. Good luck, guys.

It's sad to see you go as I felt you had one of the most creativie cards in the tournament's first round. I was looking forward to more of your work. I also want to personally thank you for pointing out the capitalization errors. I've judged cards before but never on this level and the text scores were the first thing I apologized for (See our blog "The Perfect Curve"). Honestly, capitalization never even occured to me. After talking with Zero and Thayli, we all kind of agree there is definitely overlap in the current scoring system and a better rubric needs to be made before the next round. Capitalization will be a big thing.

As for Susano'o, as was said before, I'm sorry you were upset about things but please, as Mendo said, bring your A game. A competition is a competition to win (while still having fun! ^_^).

Just as a question, what exactly is creativity? It seems to vary between tourneys. Sometimes it's based on the effect, other times the character, and sometimes both. Could you plz elaborate? Confused
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satanspawngenma
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Thu Nov 18, 2010 6:54 pm

ok well heres my entry, my earth element ninja

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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Card Maker Tournament 2010   Thu Nov 18, 2010 7:08 pm

Susano'o the Storm God wrote:
Tsu Kiyo Me wrote:
aurelio wrote:
first of all, i hate people who don't respect intelligence of other people. for instance i am talking about this retarded question:
Quote :
I dont believe you are in the bottom 2, so why exactly are you giving up?

i am giving up because judging was made with prejudices, and wasn't fair. like lovely ino said, there are entries with visible errors which are scored better than "0" or "1".

i respect guys like mjm, vsa, thayli, and others who are posting much on bandai and who are in naruto ccg for a long time, and i respect their experience in naruto ccg. i also respect mendokuse and naruto4ever like really good card makers. but, since this is a tournament of naruto fans, and judges are from bandai forum, i really can't take the fact that judging is based on giving a credits in a form of high scores for a card making, to guys who are posting every day on bandai forum, or to a guys who are in administration on this forum, which absolutely doesn't have anything with this tournament. i really don't point out to anyone.

thayli's judging was pretty good but judging of tsukiyome and zero wasn't fair at all. i really can't stand that somebody will hit "0" or "1" just because he is able to do that. this is supposed to be a fun, not a playground for a guys who are responsible for something irrelevant once in a lifetime. are you feeling powerful when you hit "0" or "1"?

If you want the justification for the effect being a "0", I didn't do it for no reason. First off, the effect was difficult to understand based on the wording. From my understanding, it became very apparent to me that it was not a fair card. Not only does it completely break the mechanics of the game, how do I keep track of who has been organized with who? Say I have Naruto and I team him with Shikamaru. Then Naruto dies. Can I group Shikamaru again? From my understanding, the card says I can't group him with other Ninjas again so I assume that means he's by himself for the rest of the game. If that's the case, after 12 turns pass, how can you prove the Shikamaru was already teamed before?

I realize the card is a super rare and thus deserves to be powerful, but I'm a big proponent of balance. And given the scoring template I was told to use, effect basically dealt with Balance from my understanding (See "Pa Toad" which also got a 0 in the effect for me because it completely shatters the game's balance and would ruin the actual game if it was released.). Creativity dealt with uniqueness. Text & Neatness also overlapped. The general consensus between the judges was that this round was a nightmare in terms of scoring and a new scoring system needs to be ironed out before we can even proceed any further so the drama from a round like this doesn't happen again.

Lovely Ino wrote:
Okie dokie, I guess I'd like to withdraw from the tourney.

I dislike this situation. Really, I'm on Susano'o's side here that the late entry was a touch unprofessional, and I can understand him feeling cheated. So, this works out best since VSA and Susano'o can both proceed. Good luck, guys.

It's sad to see you go as I felt you had one of the most creativie cards in the tournament's first round. I was looking forward to more of your work. I also want to personally thank you for pointing out the capitalization errors. I've judged cards before but never on this level and the text scores were the first thing I apologized for (See our blog "The Perfect Curve"). Honestly, capitalization never even occured to me. After talking with Zero and Thayli, we all kind of agree there is definitely overlap in the current scoring system and a better rubric needs to be made before the next round. Capitalization will be a big thing.

As for Susano'o, as was said before, I'm sorry you were upset about things but please, as Mendo said, bring your A game. A competition is a competition to win (while still having fun! ^_^).

Just as a question, what exactly is creativity? It seems to vary between tourneys. Sometimes it's based on the effect, other times the character, and sometimes both. Could you plz elaborate? Confused

It's different for everyone. To me, creativity is something that really "WOWs!" me. Something that turns my head. There are only so many times you can make a "Target: 1 Ninja Effect: Give 1 Damage" effect. Obviously, that's a good card. It's generic but it's good. Now take a look at something like MJM's card.

He took a Ninja who is notorious for making you scratch your head and think and gave him an effect that completely flips the game on it's head to compliment that. On top of that, the effect is very reminiscent of two of the old school staples for the element, Disaster & Test Proctor Anko. He put a new spin on old favorites and made it his own in the process. That's creativity.

I myself am looking for something new. Something fresh.

To narrow it down: I'm looking for someone who breaks the mold in terms of design space. The person who makes the most out of the card by relating it to the character/scene from the story, produces something unique that isn't just a rehash or something we already have, and at the same time puts their own unique flavor to it. When you make a good card and make it your own, it really shows. And I think the players know too.

It's very easy to figure out once you really dissect things who made what cards, even at Bandai. Cards that are generically good but have a small quirk to them are Andy's cards. Cards that are closely tied to the story and lend themselves very well to other cards in the deck type are Tylar's cards. Cards that have really unique effects (that may be hit or miss most of the time) are usually Brian's. See what I mean?
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